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Glossary entry

French term or phrase:

intégrer

English translation:

be accepted at, be admitted to (an institution of higher education)

Added to glossary by Alan R King
Jun 3, 2007 06:08
17 yrs ago
8 viewers *
French term

intégrer

French to English Social Sciences Education / Pedagogy School system
As in:

Ayant INTÉGRÉ l’Ecole des Eaux et Forêts de Nancy, il en sortit deuxième et choisit Bayonne comme premier lieu d’exercice.

Apologies if this is seen as a "beginner's" question. I AM a professional translator, however French is not one of my primary working languages. I can guess what intégrer seems to mean here, but such a meaning is not in my dictionary...
Proposed translations (English)
4 +2 to be accepted at
3 +3 after joining/being admitted to/after graduating (second) from
4 +1 to be part of
3 Having been admitted
Change log

Jun 3, 2007 06:17: Alan R King changed "Language pair" from "Spanish to English" to "French to English"

Discussion

CMJ_Trans (X) Jun 3, 2007:
he was then given/awarded a place at... graduating second in his year....
katsy Jun 3, 2007:
I do agree with CMJ over the development in meaning of 'intégrer'- however, 'purists' would say that you should only use 'intégrer' for entrance to "grandes écoles"
CMJ_Trans (X) Jun 3, 2007:
... here it is just "Next he won a place at/got into (these schools tend to have competitive entrance exams) from which he graduated 2nd in his year/class.....". The verb "intégrer" is not as hifalutin as it sounds
CMJ_Trans (X) Jun 3, 2007:
FYI the verb "intégrer" is often used even in CVs. Un tel a intégré la société XXx in 2007..... It just means he joined the company or entered it (he joined the ranks of). In the case of a University, it simply means he passed the entrance exam ....
Alan R King (asker) Jun 3, 2007:
The sentence stands first in the paragraph. The preceding paragraph talks about his youth which he spent in India, learning the local languages and acquiring a vocation to become a linguist (which he subsequently did). The gist of the sentence under consideration is to show how he ended up in Bayonne, where he set about learning Basque and eventually became one of the leading authorities of his time on this language.
Joseph Tein Jun 3, 2007:
I think your streamlined sentence reads very nicely, and I think the choice of whether to leave out the extra words depends on what comes before it in the paragraph. In some cases it would make sense to include that extra bit of information.
katsy Jun 3, 2007:
I'd agree with your idea Alan, more elegant than a more literal translation - in your article it may be just a way of pointing out the 'prestigious' schooling of this person for the French reader. Still, now, the meaning of 'intégrer' is perhaps clearer?
Alan R King (asker) Jun 3, 2007:
Addendum I wrote the above note before seeing katsy's and Tony's notes agreeing with Joseph, but I still think my decision is valid...
Alan R King (asker) Jun 3, 2007:
AYANT LU Tony's and Joseph's comments... :-) As a translator I don't believe in sticking any closer to the original than is absolutely necessary :-) Given your information, the context, and my intuition, I find Tony's suggestion of using "attend" (and of turning the sentence around a bit) attractive. However, looking at the actual text itself and what it is really saying, I am even more attracted to reformulating it as follows (actually my guess before reading your answers), where the verb "intégrer" actually doesn't show up at all because I feel that what it contributes to the meaning is implicit in what is there:

He graduated second from the Ecole des Eaux et Forêts at Nancy, and chose Bayonne as his first destination.

Possibly too radical a departure for the taste of some translators (but not for mine). After all, this is just an cursory background note forming part of a very long academic article (11,000 words). It would be a bit difficult to graduate from the school if he hadn't been to it, wouldn't it? To be one step more literal (and earn myself the price of three extra words), I admit I could have said "After attending the ... (school), he graduated second and chose etc." Then it would sound more like a translation ;-)

Proposed translations

+2
42 mins
Selected

to be accepted at

My little Bantam New College French/English dictionary lists 'intégrer' as a slang expression meaning 'to be accepted' (at an exclusive school). In this context then, I would suggest this as a likely meaning. So your sentence would read 'Having been accepted at the ... school, he ....' (TonyM's added note about 'gettng into' also points to this meaning.)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 45 mins (2007-06-03 06:54:01 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

(Excusez-moi ... *getting*)
Peer comment(s):
agree katsy : "getting into" (via an exam) is indeed the meaning (not slang at all) in this context. You 'intègre' (if you pass the exam) all the "grandes écoles"
20 mins
Thank you, katsy.
agree Tony M : Yes, that would be more appropriate here, and as Katsy says, it's far from being a slang register
26 mins
Thank you, Tony.
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "It was an instructive discussion. This ws the first answer that essentially coincides with what I interpret as the concensus-backed meaning, so it gets the points. Thank you everybody. Alan"
+1
22 mins

to be part of

...is the underlying meaning required here, even though it sometimes feels a little odd to English ears!

However, of course you wouldn't actually express it like that in the given context. If you wish to stick close to the FR wording and use "Having...", then I would say something like "Having been to..." or "Having attended..." — though personally, I don't like that construction and would probably try to turn the sentence round a bit to make it sound more natural in EN.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 26 mins (2007-06-03 06:34:36 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Note that Robert + Collins gives 'to join' (a club or firm) as one of the meanings for this verb, and also cf. the intransitive form 'intégrer à...' meaning 'to get into...' (university, etc.)

Personally, I would be inclined move slightly away from that when rendering it in natural English, since this is now an event in the past.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2007-06-03 07:41:06 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I agree with all you say, Alan, though I think in a way it is a shame to lose the meaning of 'integré' entirely — after all, the mere fact of having been accepted at all for this prestigious establishment should be regarded as one of this person's academic achievements!
Peer comment(s):
agree katsy : agree with your last note, Tony - see my note to Suezen
1 hr
Thanks, Katsy!
neutral CMJ_Trans (X) : see my note above - you're reading too much into this - the basic meaning of "get into" is FINE// I said "meaning". I was NOT offering that as a translation - as one of the old school, in all senses of the term, I avoid "got" like the plague.
2 hrs
I think we're in complete agreement about the underlying meaning, but given that the 'got' option is out, what are we left with? Drop the verb altogether, or use one that will emphasize the success represented by getting in in the first place...?
Something went wrong...
+3
1 hr

after joining/being admitted to/after graduating (second) from

just a couple more alternatives for the 'literal' translation but your rendering with graduated is fine ...:-)
Peer comment(s):
agree Tony M : Yes, I like 'admitted to', we do after all talk about 'university admissions' etc.
9 mins
thanks Tony :-)
agree katsy : I'd agree with admitted to, too, - sth like: He was admitted to... and, after graduating second, he...." Thus we keep the idea of the prestige
40 mins
thanks Katsy :-)
agree Najib Aloui : "joining"
4 hrs
thanks Najib
Something went wrong...
15 hrs

Having been admitted

I would rather go for a literal translation here, as the context seems a bit formal.

"Ayant" in se is formal, so that indicates for me that we should respect this formal character.
Peer comment(s):
neutral Tony M : I don't diagree about the register, but the passive construction with 'having' is not so comofrtable in EN and does not convey the register equivalent; it just sounds like a too-slavish translation
8 hrs
Something went wrong...
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