Glossary entry (derived from question below)
Spanish term or phrase:
título de sociólogo y grado de licenciado en sociología
English translation:
título [professional qualification] as a sociologist and licenciatura [licentiate degree] in sociology
Added to glossary by
María Eugenia Wachtendorff
Nov 23, 2013 20:26
10 yrs ago
19 viewers *
Spanish term
título de sociólogo y grado de licenciado en sociología
Spanish to English
Social Sciences
Education / Pedagogy
Certificates
Certifico que el alumno ......, cédula de identidad ............, realizó estudios superiores en esta Universidad, obteniendo el título de Sociólogo y el grado de Licenciado en Sociología, siendo calificado con nota 5,5 (cinco, cinco), correspondiente a Aprobado con Distinción, según Resolución de Rectoría Nº..... de fecha ......
¿Me ayudan a hacer la diferencia aquí, por favor, colegas? La universidad es chilena y la traducción es para Canadá.
¡Gracias!
¿Me ayudan a hacer la diferencia aquí, por favor, colegas? La universidad es chilena y la traducción es para Canadá.
¡Gracias!
Proposed translations
(English)
Change log
Nov 25, 2013 08:03: María Eugenia Wachtendorff changed "Edited KOG entry" from "<a href="/profile/37522">María Eugenia Wachtendorff's</a> old entry - "título de sociólogo y grado de licenciado en sociología"" to ""título [professional qualification] as a Sociologist and licenciatura [licenciate degree] in Sociology""
Proposed translations
+1
14 hrs
Selected
título [professional qualification] as a Sociologist and licenciatura [licenciate degree] in Sociolo
...gy. Two characters short in the answer box!
Perhaps another answer is superfluous here, but I want to have my two cents' worth.
I am essentially with Dariusz on this. I would definitely include the original Spanish terms, and then add English equivalents in parentheses.
Título
I don’t think either “title” or “degree” will do here. Neither is exactly wrong but neither renders the precise sense of this term as used in Latin American countries. It means “título profesional”. The terms título and licenciatura refer to two aspects of the same qualification, with the same academic requirements, but the título means that the person is professionally qualified as a sociologist (qualified to join a colegio or professional association and start practising) and the licenciatura means that the person has the requisite academic qualification to do so. It’s not just a matter of having a “title”, being entitled to call yourself a sociologist (though it is that), but of being professionally qualified.
Licenciatura
As Pablo says, “licenciado” is a classic challenge in translation. I would rather say that it is endlessly debatable. The problem is simple and familiar to all: should you call it a “bachelor’s degree” or a “licentiate degree” (or “licentiateship”)?
The argument for “bachelor’s” (or B.A. or B.S. or whatever) is that both are first degrees and that “bachelor’s” is the nearest equivalent within the target system, in which “licentiate degrees” do not exist. It has often been argued here that the word “licentiate” would not be understood by English speakers.
The argument for “licentiate” etc. is that “bachelor’s degree” is inaccurate; the two degrees are not academically equivalent, since a licenciatura involves more years of study and is a more advanced qualification. In Europe, since the Bologna reforms, it is now officially acknowledged that a Spanish licenciatura (now no longer offered in universities) is equivalent to bachelor’s + master’s.
In the many questions we have had on this, a clear majority of answers have favoured the first position, and it is easy to find examples (Pablo has quoted a couple). But these are simply the opinions of the answerers, who rarely even acknowledge that there is anything to argue about. In my opinion, accuracy should take priority over localisation, and especially in a case like this.
First, it is surely inconceivable that the people to whom this translation is directed will not be aware of these issues and will not already know what a Hispanic “licenciatura” is. The alleged incomprehensibility of the term “licentiate” is really not an issue for university evaluators anywhere. Actually, in Canada, as opposed to the US, the term itself is quite familiar, since it is applied to the postgraduate professional qualification in Medicine, the Licentiate of the Medical Council of Canada (LMCC).
It seems to me that to call the licenciatura a bachelor’s degree in this context would be inappropriate and could even be detrimental to the person involved. Imagine that this person is a candidate for a doctoral program in Canada, for which a master’s degree or equivalent is required in addition to a B.A. A given Canadian university might not regard a “licenciatura” as equivalent to bachelor’s plus master’s (or bachelor’s plus one or two years of postgraduate study); but some certainly might. But if you just say that the person has a bachelor’s degree, the application will simply be rejected, unless an alert evaluator realises that it is a mistranslation and that the candidate actually has a licenciatura.
Perhaps another answer is superfluous here, but I want to have my two cents' worth.
I am essentially with Dariusz on this. I would definitely include the original Spanish terms, and then add English equivalents in parentheses.
Título
I don’t think either “title” or “degree” will do here. Neither is exactly wrong but neither renders the precise sense of this term as used in Latin American countries. It means “título profesional”. The terms título and licenciatura refer to two aspects of the same qualification, with the same academic requirements, but the título means that the person is professionally qualified as a sociologist (qualified to join a colegio or professional association and start practising) and the licenciatura means that the person has the requisite academic qualification to do so. It’s not just a matter of having a “title”, being entitled to call yourself a sociologist (though it is that), but of being professionally qualified.
Licenciatura
As Pablo says, “licenciado” is a classic challenge in translation. I would rather say that it is endlessly debatable. The problem is simple and familiar to all: should you call it a “bachelor’s degree” or a “licentiate degree” (or “licentiateship”)?
The argument for “bachelor’s” (or B.A. or B.S. or whatever) is that both are first degrees and that “bachelor’s” is the nearest equivalent within the target system, in which “licentiate degrees” do not exist. It has often been argued here that the word “licentiate” would not be understood by English speakers.
The argument for “licentiate” etc. is that “bachelor’s degree” is inaccurate; the two degrees are not academically equivalent, since a licenciatura involves more years of study and is a more advanced qualification. In Europe, since the Bologna reforms, it is now officially acknowledged that a Spanish licenciatura (now no longer offered in universities) is equivalent to bachelor’s + master’s.
In the many questions we have had on this, a clear majority of answers have favoured the first position, and it is easy to find examples (Pablo has quoted a couple). But these are simply the opinions of the answerers, who rarely even acknowledge that there is anything to argue about. In my opinion, accuracy should take priority over localisation, and especially in a case like this.
First, it is surely inconceivable that the people to whom this translation is directed will not be aware of these issues and will not already know what a Hispanic “licenciatura” is. The alleged incomprehensibility of the term “licentiate” is really not an issue for university evaluators anywhere. Actually, in Canada, as opposed to the US, the term itself is quite familiar, since it is applied to the postgraduate professional qualification in Medicine, the Licentiate of the Medical Council of Canada (LMCC).
It seems to me that to call the licenciatura a bachelor’s degree in this context would be inappropriate and could even be detrimental to the person involved. Imagine that this person is a candidate for a doctoral program in Canada, for which a master’s degree or equivalent is required in addition to a B.A. A given Canadian university might not regard a “licenciatura” as equivalent to bachelor’s plus master’s (or bachelor’s plus one or two years of postgraduate study); but some certainly might. But if you just say that the person has a bachelor’s degree, the application will simply be rejected, unless an alert evaluator realises that it is a mistranslation and that the candidate actually has a licenciatura.
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Marcelo González
: Good option, Charles! Though I do think "title of Sociologist" works as well---title being *the distinction of being able to refer to oneself as such*. Cheers :-)
1 day 10 hrs
|
Thanks very much, Marcelo! Best to you :)
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thank you very much, Charles."
+1
45 mins
title of Sociologist and Licentiate's Degree in Sociology
li·cen·ti·ate
A degree from certain European and Canadian universities ranking just below that of a doctor.
Source: thefreedictionary.com
Depending on the target audience, you could also use "Bachelor's Degree in Sociology", although "Licentiate's Degree" is more faithful to the original. Please, check also:
Licentiate: the holder of a university degree intermediate between that of bachelor and that of doctor, now confined chiefly to certain continental European universities.
Source: thefreedictionary.com
A degree from certain European and Canadian universities ranking just below that of a doctor.
Source: thefreedictionary.com
Depending on the target audience, you could also use "Bachelor's Degree in Sociology", although "Licentiate's Degree" is more faithful to the original. Please, check also:
Licentiate: the holder of a university degree intermediate between that of bachelor and that of doctor, now confined chiefly to certain continental European universities.
Source: thefreedictionary.com
Example sentence:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Licentiate's+degree
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Marcelo González
: Hi Ana. As long as "licenciado" (or licenciatura) is included in parenthesis or italicized, something like this is fine. The "title of xx" is the *distinction of being able to refer to oneself as such*. But I'd say "the degree of Licentiate in __."
1 day 23 hrs
|
Hi Marcelo. Thank you for the agree and the comment. I really appreciate it :) Have a nice week!
|
+2
2 hrs
a Sociology degree, with the diploma of Bachelor (of Arts) in Sociology
'licenciado' is one of the classic challenges in translation. It represents the basic undergraduate degree in Latin America and as such usually translates as B.A. or B.S., as appropriate.
'título' here, in my view, is best rendered as 'degree', and 'sociólogo' reworked as a field of study (sociology).
See analogous case of 'título de economista': http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish_to_english/bus_financial/2...
And analogous case of 'licenciado en psicología':
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish_to_english/certificates_di...
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Note added at 2 hrs (2013-11-23 22:39:37 GMT)
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Sorry, correction, definite article at the beginning: "the Sociology degree, with the diploma of Bachelor of Arts in Sociology".
Or, could say "the degree in Sociology..." (etc.)
'título' here, in my view, is best rendered as 'degree', and 'sociólogo' reworked as a field of study (sociology).
See analogous case of 'título de economista': http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish_to_english/bus_financial/2...
And analogous case of 'licenciado en psicología':
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish_to_english/certificates_di...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2013-11-23 22:39:37 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Sorry, correction, definite article at the beginning: "the Sociology degree, with the diploma of Bachelor of Arts in Sociology".
Or, could say "the degree in Sociology..." (etc.)
Note from asker:
Thank you so much for all your help, Pablo! |
Discussion
Anyway, this should be discussed separately. Thank you for all your help, Dariusz! I owe you :)
http://translorial.com/2000/05/01/educational-documents-tran...